Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

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andarist
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2016 2:33 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby andarist » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:30 pm

I personally dont have a r8, so cant comment on that... but I definitely think it was a move in the right direction.

I just wanted to 3rd or 4th what Maeglin said about the scalp rewards. With the increased competition with people going for R8 (so greedy!), as well as people going for r7 (also greedy!), combined with the smaller pbase, makes it a lot more challenging to achieve.

In terms of clan bonuses, I would definitely give the option to the clans, and as a warrior, would love pertinent pracs bonuses as well!

Rig
Posts: 660
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:00 pm
Location: JESUS

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Rig » Mon Jan 09, 2017 7:53 pm

Loomis wrote:
Rig wrote:Considering that it's nigh impossible to remort because none of you assholes like to smob! I would actually like to probably stay a trolloc if we got the r8 bonuses. Rig is a terrible leader.


Great, now we'll never get him outta Ko'bal :lol:


Help me smob dick!

Paigey
Posts: 69
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 9:37 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Paigey » Mon Jan 09, 2017 10:30 pm

-On clan practice bonuses - I think the ultimate goal should be to convert it to a set number of practices. Along with the examples given - rogues with shield parry and warriors with attack, think channelers who opt for shield parry or dodge. On a generic channeler, free 50% shield parry would be worth about 16 practices. Whether the practice bonus is too much or too little kind of brings me back to the above - its variable. For hunters, if the bonus ends up in a ranger practice its worth almost nothing. Unless you are using a 1 handed weapon, bash, charge build - you probably aren't short on practices. As a rule the bonus probably does nothing for people in abs - they've already got practices in the bag. If you can get the bonus in a 3-4 practice skill its obviously a huge win - characters with things that cost 3-4 tends to be short on practices ie. channelers or warriors who are trying to build a 1 handed combo set-up with level 7 survival. Last of all, the practice bonus will be a semi-slap in the face for people who can't use it all. ie. if the Ghar'ghael warriors outvote the Ghar'ghael hunters and push for attack.

-The weapon point system is probably most advantageous for combo. Assuming the weapons can be rented and can be hardened/honed with money, you can add 2.5 lbs to combo weapons like brass hilted or saw axe. Perhaps I'm crazy, but most abs weapons already bash pretty well. Other than making wickedly scythed 2.5 lbs heavier, is there really a reason to make bronze axe 20 lbs? Would it really be any better? I don't know, but I suspect turning a 13 lb weapon into a 15 lb weapon makes things pretty interesting. Adding 5 parry or 5 OB (assuming you can throw down H/H) - probably less game changing and not worth the qps.

-At the moment I can't see any reason to keep this from trolls other than the fact that getting a scalp over there is already hell. I'm sure this will make troll rogues very happy.

-A reroll at 2000 - cool. No issue.

-The BMI change - no one understands it. Hard to pick something so uncertain. Does it really make me harder to bash? Or would I really bash that much better? If I pick one, does it negatively affect my ability to do the other ie. I become a better dodger but a worse basher? Who knows.

-The 10's - neat, but I suspect most people will pick hps over the other 2 every day of the week and twice on Sunday. I doubt anyone wants a comparison to darkside bonuses, but dreadguards get a 30 sps bonus.

-Horse mobol. I would consider moving this to 1500 qps. Adding this helps humans address a painful intelligence gap that exists when there isn't someone with "sense" around. There's an enormous difference between characters who have "sense" and those who don't on the offensive and the defensive.

-No food/drink - nice. The more I think about it, the more I like it.

-Chest pieces, no issue other than that the combo chest piece is last I checked inferior to the fade plate.

-Homeland Change - I hate to complicate things, but I'd almost say let non-channelers get this at 1500-2000. For non-channelers, the homeland change is a HUGE opportunity and yet not really game changing for the game. If you're from a crap homeland, ie. Tarabon this allows you to upgrade to a homeland that will actually allow you to use your rerolls which you probably haven't gotten to take advantage of. If the homeland change actually allows you to buff an old character - perhaps this will give you a reason to play this character more/devote yourself to it.

-Adding the 1 point - I think the weird thing about that point is that its only worth adding to certain stats. Ie. adding it to con is unreliable - you have no idea what hps it will get you...

-For channelers, yeah, the borderland nations do create some unbelievable opportunities and probably are kind of out of line with some of the other channeler homelands. I suspect if we all could see the dreadlord rerolls possibilities they wouldn't seem that ridiculous. The borderlands are also interesting because - channelers aren't allowed 19 dex. So if you can get everything else in place with 17 dex - dex is a great category to add 1 to. An 18 dex Illian FC can't have 19 dex. As above, adding 1 to con is unreliable.

My advice for anyone going for rank 8 - make sure you put your time into a character worth doing it on. Pick the clan with the most bonuses and the least restrictions. As times passes you'll want to do other things/explore other options and if you pick overly restrictive clans you won't be able to.

Petra
Posts: 147
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 5:02 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Petra » Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:52 am

Paigey wrote:-

-For channelers, yeah, the borderland nations do create some unbelievable opportunities and probably are kind of out of line with some of the other channeler homelands. I suspect if we all could see the dreadlord rerolls possibilities they wouldn't seem that ridiculous.


They still look silly! Borderlands have a higher statsum than DL 'homeland'.

Razhak
Posts: 288
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2015 7:43 am

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Razhak » Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:11 am

I am fine with it, as long as Razhak also gets it!

Guest

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Guest » Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:41 am

I think including fcs in r8 bonuses is the only bad thing. They're already the easiest/most powerful char in the game, giving them fade shirts and the ability to switch to blands with high sums and reroll a few times just doesnt make much sense.

For clan bonuses: I think allowing clans to cherry-pick prac bonuses is kinda defeating the point. If the intent was to just give clanned characters a prac boost, this solution has a rather huge disparity among clans, as already noted. If the intent was to give clans some defining flavor, then just assign rpish prac bonuses and if the clan decides they have a more rpish preference and it is legit, then fine. Giving gaidin rescue, for example. It has little-to-no actual in-game balance effect, but is perfectly fitting rpishly. Versus giving ko'bal shield parry instead of hide or something. It just doesn't make much sense from any point of view. If you just want to give random bonuses, why not figure out a way to just give all clanned characters an extra 10 pracs and a vanilla cookie.

Baal
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:20 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Baal » Tue Jan 10, 2017 10:38 am

Do you feel the clan prac bonus is too much, or too little?
-I think it's fine as is, it is a bonus after all.

Do you think it's fair if say, a rogue only clan would opt for 50% shield parry (or a clan full of warriors going for 50% attack), giving them a greater benefit due to uniform class compared to mixed-class clans?
-There will of course be a disparity but I don't think it matters enough that you should worry about it. I think the only clans this really effects everyone for is Ko'bal and Ghar'ghael anyway. I don't think that Ko having more shield parry will make them any less annoying to pk with or against. More Ghars being zerk all the time can only equal more fun.

There will likely be a limit as to how often a clan can change these, what do you feel is a fair amount of time?
-3 months

Please keep in mind that the rank 8 stuff, especially the horse scouting mobol, is pretty much the best we can do without coding. We had requested a coding change in Summer 2015, but that has yet to be made/implemented. As such, coding is pretty much not an option. In this light:

Do you feel that the rank 8 bonuses are underpowered, or overpowered?
-I feel like there isn't enough rank 8's in the game to truly measure this, but I personally cannot tell the difference when pking with/against the people that have them.

Should they be extended to DS to give trollocs an option beyond remorting?
-There really isn't any reason not to do so.

Supposing we ever do get around to upping qp rewards, would you pursue this?
-Please do up the qp rewards. The one thing that I have noticed with the introduction of the r8 rewards is that masters are less likely to split scalps with unmastered characters, which is just bad news any way you put it. I understand that everyone wants to have some reward for the time spent, so make it worthwhile for the people who are playing.

Or, up the qp rewards for non-mastered characters and have them reduced for players who are already mastered, similar to fades. Idk, this seems to be less of a problem on ds, even for players that are trying to fade. Maybe it's just mindset.

Edit: In regards to pursuit of r8 and fcs, my fc is one of the 2 characters that I actually might bother pursue r8 on, just because she is pretty limited as fcs go. R8 takes a lot of time, as does statting. Honestly the people that have blands channies with amazing stats have put a lot of time into making them, I say if they have that kind of time, all the power to them. I have 3 channies that I play with 13 con because I would rather spend my time playing.
Last edited by Baal on Tue Jan 10, 2017 1:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sarryn
Posts: 132
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2015 7:30 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Sarryn » Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:35 pm

Do you feel the clan prac bonus is too much, or too little?
It's good, would like for the clan to be able to vote to decide what they are able to get as a unit.

Do you think it's fair if say, a rogue only clan would opt for 50% shield parry (or a clan full of warriors going for 50% attack), giving them a greater benefit due to uniform class compared to mixed-class clans?
I'm ok with this, it's a clan bonus. Let them decide what to get. I think if you join a clan like say ghar which are generally warriors, you might be the odd one out in the attack argument.

There will likely be a limit as to how often a clan can change these, what do you feel is a fair amount of time?
3-6 months is fair.

Do you feel that the rank 8 bonuses are underpowered, or overpowered?
They are pretty good with what we have to work with (aka no coding) I don't feel like they cause a great desire to play right now honestly. I for one would love to get there. I just can't really put forth the time or effort right now. 3k qps now days is quite impressive. It's always been a bit excessive in my mind. Maybe in our hay day it was more obtainable. Wouldn't mind seeing it lowered to 2k or 2.5k. Pk is scarce to say the least. There's a lot of people vying for scalps. Scalp awards are bad at the present time. I think 2k is fair.

Should they be extended to DS to give trollocs an option beyond remorting?
Yes of course..., but of course not for fades/dl's. They are quite bonused as is. Honestly LS channelers shouldn't get this either in my opinion...I really believe in that. There stupid powerful now days, and annoying.

Supposing we ever do get around to upping qp rewards, would you pursue this?
Not really as stated above. The scarcity of pk now days, combined with just in general lack of playing time as we get older. I think 3k qps is a lofty goal. I've always baffled at the attempt of such goals so could just be me. I am fairly close on a dead seanchan side 600ishqps. But meh takes ages. I'm little over half way there on this guy. It would take me incredibly long given the stated above reasons.
I've always had a lot of respect at some peoples commitment to get the high qp things like re-morting, rank 8. But I could never really bring myself to take scalps after mastering. Honestly the majority of my scalps after mastering has been solo/no clanned pk. It's a lofty goal at any rate.
I personally would be completely ok with the rewards being made 4 for a bit, 7 for a scalp, 10 for a head. Given the lack of numbers compared to the days of 100+ on it's fine with me.

Still would love to see a remort added to LS.

Still would love something done with Seanchan side to more integrate them into the game. Condensing zones? Making them not get aggroed up north? Connection from BE to the north? Remort ogier? Removing/merging the side with LS? I dunno?! Mob support on the map like ds has...cough so we can pk elsewhere.

Elysia
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:29 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby Elysia » Tue Jan 10, 2017 1:31 pm

Paigey wrote:-On clan practice bonuses - I think the ultimate goal should be to convert it to a set number of practices.


Guest wrote:why not figure out a way to just give all clanned characters an extra 10 pracs and a vanilla cookie.


This is coding and thus pretty much not currently possible, sorry.

Note that we did say there has to be an rpish element to the clan practice bonuses, it just depends on interpretation of how rpish any given argument is, I guess.

arkaza
Posts: 118
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:17 pm

Re: Review of clan prac bonuses and rank 8 bonuses.

Postby arkaza » Tue Jan 10, 2017 2:24 pm

I dont think any clan should get 50% shield parry EXCEPT for KO and that's only because they can no longer remort.


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