Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

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Naathel
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:00 pm

Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Naathel » Mon Dec 17, 2018 2:23 pm

Hi all

posting this as I (and from what i understood also the other person involved in the following incident) would welcome the information.

Non clanned, non wanted LS character wanders about near EF. Clanned, high ranking Seanchan character appears and attacks on sight. LS player thinks he knows how SS behave and is clearly confused, ooc discussion follows, Seanchan clanned player claims he had every right to do so.

I know there were 'similar' cases (eg. Xin stabbing a White Tower clan player while in the same PK group against DS), and i read a thread in SS forums about what to do with specific non-hostile clans, but this is a bit different, and I would welcome the clarifications.

What are the rules concerning clanned Seanchans and interactions with non-clanned, non-wanted normal LS players? And to be more specific is there a reason why a high ranking Seanchan would attack on sight somebody that is not warranted, doesn't belong to a hostile clan, or doesn't belong to a clan at all? Is this in line with Seanchan RP behaviour, does it minimally reflect the books this mud is based on and how is this behaviour different from DS? Obviously everybody is free to do what they want, murder who they want etc and there are of course consequences, here i am asking about the general policy of SS, not about the actions of a single player.

The question is genuine as I have SS characters too and in various discussions i thought it was clear that Seanchan clans don't randomly attack other LS players, unless they are wanted, or belong to a hostile clan. Since the high ranking SS player thought the opposite, here goes the question.

Cheers

Baco
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:57 am

Response to the Question

Postby Baco » Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:21 am

This post and question post should both be deleted.

The answer is that no where on the mud are players free from PK. The only RP restrictions would be enforced with laws on either side. Yes, it is probably against the law in the Two Rivers to attack people, but the Seanchan all have warrants there. Yes, it is possible to RP your way out of a situation involving Seanchan attacking you, but all depends, would probably be wiser to just run away.

The only guidelines (and I do mean guidelines because no would get in trouble for breaking them) is Seanchan often don't attack or kill AFK people, people who are nude, and people under the level of 20.

raek
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:28 pm

Clarification on Tales of Empire post and lack of RP

Postby raek » Tue Dec 18, 2018 9:22 am

This post and question post should both be deleted.

The answer is that no where on the mud are players free from PK. The only RP restrictions would be enforced with laws on either side. Yes, it is probably against the law in the Two Rivers to attack people, but the Seanchan all have warrants there. Yes, it is possible to RP your way out of a situation involving Seanchan attacking you, but all depends, would probably be wiser to just run away.

The only guidelines (and I do mean guidelines because no would get in trouble for breaking them) is Seanchan often don't attack or kill AFK people, people who are nude, and people under the level of 20.


This response is utterly bizarre to me. While everyone knows that no one is immune to pk, I also have always thought that LS clans (which SS are now) have a certain obligation to RP and could suffer consequences from immortals if they don't adhere. I have seen many examples of this played out. If my Winged Guard character started murdering innocent people, he'd be deranked.

I get that a trolloc would not have any book reason for not attacking any human. Trollocs kill humans, it's what they do. However, Seanchan in the books would have no incentive to walk up to a random, unaffiliated travellor and strike them down. In fact, doing so would be a detriment to their ultimate goal of forwarding the Corenne through conversion. The premise that the leaders of the Ever Victorious Army would be OK with their soldiers killing innocent people that are no threat is absolutely preposterous. Seanachan soldiers are HUMANS that are disciplined in the books. They are not blood thirsty killers that think, "Hell, I'm already wanted here, so I'll kill whomever I deem fit."

I get not everyone in this mud is into RP. However, extreme violations of the source material detract from the fun that RPers hope to have while playing. I honestly think there needs to be a balance.

Meren
Posts: 156
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 10:45 pm

Re: Clarification on Tales of Empire post and lack of RP

Postby Meren » Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:16 pm

It is worth considering that players are not ever "random travelers", we're the heroes of this game/world.

As such when a Seanchan player sees you, they can ask you to swear the Oaths, and chances are that like most you'll come up with some tough guy retort, and their element of surprise for an attack is gone. The other way to see it is that you have not approached the Seanchan to swear the Oaths. This means you are an Oathbreaker by default, and fair game.

There is nothing wrong RP-wise with either approach, to me.

Elysia
Posts: 4711
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:29 pm

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Elysia » Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:54 pm

Merged 2 ToC posts and a Player's Lounge thread, as this sort of thing has no place on ToC.

Reyne
Posts: 334
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:46 am

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Reyne » Tue Dec 18, 2018 2:05 pm

As far as I'm aware the policy has been "if you haven't sworn the Oaths you are fair game" for some time now. They are an invading army, after all. I think perhaps you can beg to swear the Oaths but they have no obligation to you? It's certainly not mentioned in the posted rules of the Empire.

Meren wrote:The Empire does not care about your allegiance, intent, or reason. Only that you swear.


Plus everyone on this continent is already an oathbreaker in Seanchan eyes, as Meren points out. As in, none of us are strictly 'innocent' even if we have no Seanchan warrant.

In fact, doing so would be a detriment to their ultimate goal of forwarding the Corenne through conversion.


Been some time since I've read the books, but is that really the goal of the Corenne? They'll gladly accept Oaths but they are still an invading army. I do remember Bayle Domon's ship getting commandeered and Bayle himself being taken da'coval. That's not really peaceful conversion.

Or, to put it simply, they might be "LS" now but to me that's more to consolidate players vs any kind of official change as to the status of the Seanchan. As far as PK goes I don't really see them as 'same side' still, although obviously DS takes precedence.

raek
Posts: 59
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2016 4:28 pm

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby raek » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:12 pm

You're all using linguistic gymnastics to try to RP explain SS murdering an unkonwn person. In a real RP world, how would they even know whether that person has sworn the oaths or not (or is willing to but hasn't been in contact with an officer or not) without a discussion?

Instead of trying to poorly explain away this bad RP, just find me a single instance in the entire book series where a Seanchan Army member goes up to a random person and murders him.

Terinor
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:19 pm

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Terinor » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:33 pm

Part of the issue is that since ss became humans they’re not seen as a different race but as same side murderers. But ss also gets insta warranted by every nation south of the borderlands simply for existing. This would present to me a case of if you’re not with us, you’re against us. And I understand you arguing for the rp of it but there is also gameplay to consider. Solo trollocs don’t go roaming around andor trying to backstab people either.

Maeglin
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 9:47 pm

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Maeglin » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:37 pm

raek wrote:In a real RP world, how would they even know whether that person has sworn the oaths or not (or is willing to but hasn't been in contact with an officer or not) without a discussion?


In the books, the seanchan just invaded cities in totality, THEN they told the commoners to swear the oaths. They weren't roaming around trying to get random people to swear the oaths in unsecured territory. This entire situation is one of the major cons of converting SS though, so good luck.

Xin
Posts: 65
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:10 am

Re: Clarification on policy concerning Seanchan Officers and non-clanned, non-hostile players

Postby Xin » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:50 pm

Well, if you haven't sworn the Oaths you're free game.

Seanchan can now check if you have sworn the Oaths at an officer mob located in Almoth and Tarendrelle.

That said your actions determine your affiliation and sometimes asking an officer mob that is miles away is not feasible.

Here are some actions that could highlight that you are not sworn:
- Attacking Seanchan
- Grouping with known oathbreakers
- Hanging out in oathbreaker cities
- Exping/smobbing with oathbreakers
- Being a Marath'damane or grouping with one

There are a whole bunch more I am sure but basically if you don't look and act like a Seanchan then its a fair assumption you're an Oathbreaker. If you've sworn the Oaths you are expected to go to a reasonable effort to behave like a Seanchan, it's not a free pass to do whatever you like and get boat access. If you swear the Oaths and don't act like a Seanchan then you will be hunted.

Now Seanchan is no longer a separate race its also highly encouraged that you join a clan as it makes it easier for us to identify you and it also makes it easier for you to participate as a Seanchan particularly as mobs only assist clanned etc.

If you don't want to join a clan and you just want to RP as a Seanchan or sworn, that's great but its really down to you to identify and act as such.

Here are some things you can do to identify that you are a Seanchan/sworn as an unclanned person:
- Spend time with other Seanchan players in game and don't hang around with Oathbreakers (we should know who you are)
- Put it in your title (not everyone's cup of tea but a very easy way to tell us particularly if you don't/can't spend a lot of time with us)

Naathel wrote:(eg. Xin stabbing a White Tower clan player while in the same PK group against DS


Marath'damane are always fair game however I would like to point out that I stabbed the Marath'damane after it appeared the DS have left, it was unfortunate that they reappeared right after. If you're a Marath'damane it's probably worth your while to be cautious of Seanchan at all times. If you don't want to die then you're welcome to swear the Oaths and we can find you a suitable Sul'dam.

Xin the Mandarb'a'shar [Imperial Army Council]


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